osin83

I really dont understand why people are trying to push this idea that allowing access to the GPU will be like a virtual ANYTHING.

I like to envision it more like goin from the CPU handling most of the graphics leg work to getting help from the GPU. So it's kind of like a CPU and a GPU... no?

I think some people just made a poor analogy and is refusing to give up on it. This is supposed to be a Pre vs Hero thread and digging through all this junk to try and help me make a decision by this weekend is becoming useless

Slayix312

That's your problem right their. Just pick up a Hero or Pre and do 30 days on it. All these people including myself are just biased towards one or the other. I have heard A LOT of people complaining about crap that I could give 2 sh*ts about.

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cardfan

Welp, depends on how long you plan on keeping the device. The Pre has the guts to take a lot of updates and be improved. Though its not that durable and may need to be exchanged multitple times.

The Hero seems durable enough but has inferior guts. You're relying on Sprint to approve updates. And HTC to provide updates to its UI.

Depends on your needs which one has the best features. JMO but for what its worth, i've been a smartphone user for years now. Absent any other competition and sticking with sprint, i'd get a Palm Pre because and in no particular order:

1. Cards multitasking.
2. Notifications
3. Integrated synergy i prefer.
4. Form factor. Easy to use real kb. Great size screen. Looks sharp.
5. Easy as pie patches & homebrew. Mytether makes it a mifi.
6. Frequent updates. Having the OS & the hardware will become an even greater benefit for palm users as time goes on and android devices fragment further.
7. This forum. Home of homebrew and very helpful. Weekly podcasts.
8. Promise of flash, docs to go, etc. As well as sideloading. Wait til api's to the mic get put in. Callrec? The sdk will improve.
9. Touchstone in car can be nice, Pre integrates well with BT stereos
10. Browser is superior. UI is just much better.

doublebullout

And cardfan is right about this --> you really do need to try both devices to discover the strengths and weaknesses of both. FWIW, I'll add my comments below.Personal preference. I like the card method too, but Android works well and doesn't have the "too many cards" bugs.
Personal preference. Android's notification system is more subtle. I didn't like it at first, but after living with it I actually prefer it.
SenseUI has this already built-in, and so does Android 2.0. Works about the same in both webOS and Android.
The Pre wins here, although it's not a slam dunk.
If you like to tinker with the OS, there's no question that you'll have more control with webOS. But you'll have less reason to tinker with Android because many of the webOS patches simply add options that are already built-in to Android. And Android can tether too.
This must be largely taken on faith as this point. It's not the number of Android devices, but rather the "skins" like Blur and SenseUI that manufacturers put on top. There's no evidence yet that this will be a big problem. HTC/Sprint is about to release the first update for the Hero, so we'll see soon.
Clear win for the Pre. The androidcentral forums are still underutilized. The phandroid podcast is, to be perfectly blunt, amateurish and of limited value. It's like listening to Bill and Ted with a dash of Spicoli. Like, uh, I mean, really, dude. Basically.
Android is already there.
Touchstone is a great accessory, no doubt. If only using the phone and webOS was as consistently pleasing...
Personal preference. This has been debated in other threads, so I won't rehash it here. I will say that in my own experience, Android/SenseUI is far and away more helpful and useful in my day-to-day activities than webOS is. If all I did was use the browser, maybe I'd feel differently.

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HTC Hero

mu7efcer

I am a huge Hero fan. I demo'd it for about a week before Sprint made it clear that I couldn't swap my Pre for a Hero. I prefer the Hero over the Pre.

But, I have to disagree with this. IMHO contact linking on the Hero is nowhere near as nice as synergy is on the Pre. The Hero can link a contact to facebook, but the only data it will import from facebook is: birthday and picture. Synergy imports phone numbers, email, and other stuff that you store in facebook.

Additionally, if you have more than one contact record in google, on the Pre you can link those contacts into one contact. On the Hero you can't. You can only link a google contact to facebook or flickr.

There are a couple of things that the Hero's contact linking does better than Pre (IMHO). First, if you go look at a linked contact on the web version of google contacts, you'll see something like this in the notes:

<sn>id:xxxxxxxxxx/friendof:yyyyyyyyyy</sn>

Which means that contact linking on Hero survives a complete device wipe. On the Pre, if you manually link two contacts, you'll have to do it again after a device wipe.

Second, the Hero will show you the friend's facebook status. Which the Pre doesn't show, at all anywhere.

I'm hopeful that contact linking in Android 2.0 will fix some of the contact linking defecits that are in 1.5 (the version currently on the Hero).

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lexspre

I don't know if this is an interesting topic to others or not, but I felt that many pre owners would porbably wonder about the match up of pre vs her. I spent 2 weeks with the hero and took it back for a pre...I'm very happy with my pre. It is not as feature rich as the hero, the ui is less customizable, but I think its better. My girlfriend also got a hero an chose to keep it when I got the pre. Being the phone junky I am I had to compare side by side. I saw a few youtube videos on the subject but felt they were not doing a good job comparing browsers side by side, and the camera is a big deal to me. I did several speed tests downloading large myspace pages, and dozens of other pages. The palm pre loaded about 9 out of 10 pages faster, I actually timed them and the pre completely loaded pages on average 14 to 15 seconds faster than the hero, both very even on the quality the page was rendered, full desktop quality. Although the hero displays flash which is fun. I disabled plugins in the her browser and it disabled flash, the timed results were exactly the same...pre is way faster! One more thing to note is that the pinch to zoom is amazingly buggy on the hero so pre was faster, but also way easier to navagate around. Lastly, the camera on the hero takes slightly blurry pictures, although 5 magapixels, zoom feature, and auto focus, the pre takes more clear pictues, so when you zoom into a pictture you have taken, its very clear...in the proper lighting. I take alot of pictures of my 3yr old so I also enjoy the fact that the pre camera shoots them fast as my son is fast. I should note, for me, I care less about apps which the hero has plenty of, and I need great web browsing and good camera. But I do hope palm succeeds in the smartphone biz and makes alot more apps for palm users. Hopefully thi helps anyone who thinks or wishes they had the new hott stuff hero. The pre is better or worst, depending on what you want it for

berdinkerdickle

<<moved to correct forum>>

and,

<<merged to already existing thread>>

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Berd

7hk11

Dear grndslm,

LOL.

That is all

faculak99

AGAIN - it depends what you use it for. I was soooooo looking forward to the PRE, but the Hero will be my next phone soon if I don't see the bugs going away in the PRE.

If you use the phone for what a real smartphone was meant to do, then the Hero would be the winner TODAY. I can't speak for tomorrow. A real smartphone is not goofy apps, nor is it the ability to browse the web, christ my PSP can do that.

A smartphone needs to keep accurate contacts with quick and easy access. A smartphone needs to have a reliable calender that can sync with your web information. Currently the PRE has bugs with both issues. No favorites for contacts other than the old push and hold a number on the dial pad. And no, homebrews don't count. I shouldn't have to jack my phone up for it to be useful. The calender crap is what kills me. Repeat events, or events lost. I can't afford for that crap to happen. If I make appointments, they need to be kept.

I love the cards too, and the physical shape of the thing (PRE) is awesome. However, a smartphone can't be a smartphone, if it makes you look like a *******. I miss an appointment for even one grievance or hearing, and my clients make me feel the loss both physically and financially.

Get the PRE if you can be patient on the OS, but as technology is soaring to new heights every second, I plan to go Hero, then hopefully get another look at the Web OS from Palm at a later time when it acts like a smartphone!


Currently I have a 3G iPhone. Here is an example of a great smartphone ruined by a terrible provider. ATT sucks, and for the same reasons I mentioned about the PRE, the syncing calenders with ATT's 3G network is just as sorry.

Enjoy your new phone! -- LOL

jabou

Keep in mind the Hero is stuck right now on Andoid 1.5. The G1 on T-mobile is on Android 1.6 and the new Droid is on 2.0
That is very lame in my book for a lot of reasons.

lexspre

I recently made a thread for pre vs hero, an then came across this one. Doesn't seem like anyones posted in a while but, I had the hero for a few weeks and returned it for a pre, my girlfriend kept her htc hero. I love the ui on the pre, and felt that the web browser is sooo much better for navagating in web pages. To respont to other peoples coments, the pres interface is kinda slugish, but the efects that flow are 2nd to none. I use my phone for web browsing not apps so much so android doesn't win for me there although some people, maby most get phones based on apps, so maby android is better for some people. I have tested the browsers side by side, when downloading large web pages like myspace profiles, and other large data intensive pages, my pre beats my girlfriends hero when timed by about 15 seconds to completely download the pages. The hero ui is more snappy, but like I said, for me the browser is where its at, and the pre toys with the hero. The hero is rich with features, so I do like the hero alot, and could have been happy with it. If pre would ad video, flash, and more apps, it would be hands down, pre victorious. I'll also note that I disabled plugins in the hero browser, which disables flash and it mad hardly any difference in web speed. If its alot of cool features, apps, and customization you like, get android, if you want very smooth, capable web browsing, its pre. An I like the pre ui enough to not want to customize it anyway. Thanks guys...

grndslm

Heh... glad somebody got a kick outta that. I'm not sure what those guys were thinking when they said that enabling graphics acceleration wouldn't AT LEAST double the speed of the Pre and give it nearly 50% greater battery life. I simply don't think they realize how many graphical animations/transitions there are in the Pre. But I'll be willing to admit defeat when they come back and show me some numbers of how many processes are actually used for each of the many animations/transitions. There's at least a dozen key graphical "features" that cause the lag seen with the CPU. Enabling graphics acceleration would free more CPU processes than [most] any developer would know what to do with.

This is exactly what I said when I hopped into this thread. I only played with the Hero for 30 min in the Sprint store, but it was very clear that the browser on the Hero really couldn't compare to the Pre. Even just double-tapping a column in the Hero's browser would never resize it the way I wanted. The Pre does just it right every time (except in text fields on occasion). Pre's DEFINITELY better in these two areas, and they were certainly the highlights of what I was looking for in terms of functionality for a device I'll have for 12+ months.

Me too. Those are definitely the Pre's highlights... along with the potential that is Palm & WebOS. Updates should be in sync soon enough with foreign carriers and the Pixi. And, of course, there is no forum quite like this one for Android that is the "home" of homebrew, development, and community in general. And also... competition is good... so hopefully Palm can keep cranking out great ideas that other people can rip off of. Palm is the perfect blend between Apple & Google. They take the best of each model and throw it into one bad *** melting pot.

Fair enough. What do you NEED your smartphone to do? From the rest of your post, it looks like you just need a calendar. Dude... I'm sure your PSP could handle that, right?!?

Why do people always say this? If this were the case, the iPhone would've never sold. Everybody would've bought a Treo 755p because it had EVERYTHING that the iPhone didn't have AND THEN SOME. The only thing that the iPhone had was the UI with pretty transitions. That's it... and it sold MILLIONS.

Correct. Your PSP has an *awesome* browser. Lemme tell ya.

As jabou has pointed out, WebOS will be updated many, many, many times... while the Hero will be LUCKY to get one software update. Why would HTC waste their time on working with Sprint to update Android 1.5 when 2.1 will be coming out soon enough on the HTC Shazzam and HTC BlamBlow. This is the reason I bought the Pre last week was because of the hardware/software integration. It makes a ton of sense. The splintering of Android on devices that didn't actually create Android doesn't make a whole lotta sense to me, because the manufacturer's will have no incentive to release updates to their older hardware when they can simply release newer hardware with the newer OS.

You're comparing a 2nd generation iPhone with 3rd generation software to a Pre, which has been around for 5 months? Very fair.

If all you need is a calendar, perhaps I should introduce you to the Redneck Palm Pilot... Redneck Palm Pilot

THETRUTH

You guys are comparing the pre browser to the group and your leaving out key points. Last I checked you can't view youtube without a direct link with the pre. You don't have any flash. You have to flip the phone sideways just so you can see the small text.. no intelligent zoom. No options except turning off java and pop-ups. It's not a bad phone but even when things are plain to see. Pre lovers still make excuses for the phone. Go pick up a hero and look in the options for the browser and then you will see all the options missing. My hero is just as fast for browsing if I disable javascript. I have done side by side comps

I compare the two in many ways and the more I use the hero the more I forget about the pre. The hero is a better phone and the numbers will proove it soon enough. Palm has to continue to update because they sold you an incomplete product. All I need is 2.0 and I am good. One update, not 10 and a boat load of patches to get my phone to do what I want.
I know the flaming is coming, so excuse me while I get my popcorn.

Bujin

I hear this argument a lot, and it always kind of bugs me. It's a fair argument if you're comparing the development of the OS, or discussing whether Palm is on the right track with OS / updates, etc. However, it's not a compelling argument if someone is comparing which phone they'd buy, or which one is the "better phone".

When a person walks into a store, they don't buy on future potential - they want to buy the one that best meets their needs now. They don't say "well, if I had a choice between the Pre and the original iPhone, Pre would win, so I'll buy that". They say "well, the Pre is off to a good start, but the 3GS meets my needs better so I'll buy that."

I love my Pre, and I'm sure that the next version will be even better. But I'd consider an Android phone if it had a hardware keyboard, larger (maybe AMOLED) screen and if Android 2.x is slick. I'm actually tempted by the Moment more than the Hero.

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Treo600 --> Treo650-->PPC6700-->Treo700P-->Treo755P-->Treo800W --> Touch Pro-->Palm Pre

THETRUTH

1+ above. It's about now for me and most people. If palm fixes the issues on the next pre, I can see it being great, but its incomplete as of now. They have a very intuitive product with lots of potential.

cardfan

People keep talking about the next Pre. Palm would have to release a different form factor (slab) to get me interested again. Big high rez screen, high end phone.

I'll have to wait to see what Apple has in mind before worrying about upgrading.

Bujin

I really don't see a slab happening - they've invested a great deal in the idea that the keyboard and multi-tasking are what differentiates them from the iPhone. But time will tell.

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Treo600 --> Treo650-->PPC6700-->Treo700P-->Treo755P-->Treo800W --> Touch Pro-->Palm Pre

grndslm

That's my point tho... when people were buying the first gen iPhone... every last one of them made the wrong decision when it came to the "better phone". It had no SDK, no 3rd party apps, no supported homebrew, no MMS, no video recording, no copy & paste, no hardware keyboard, etc. Yet it still sold? Why? Because people liked the Apple "platform".

Same reason I bought the Palm over the Android phones. I like their platform better. I like that they have the best hardware keyboards around, I like the portrait sliding keyboard, I like the rolling updates for constant tweaking, I like the supported homebrew, I love the sweet camera (I want to see one person take pics in the same spot with the Pre, 3Gs, and Droid), I love the browser (other than text fields sometimes! ), and, of course, I love this forum!! The fact that Palm isn't Apple or Google is a plus for me, too, because I want more competition... a company that is thinking of things like the Pre form factor, WebOS, Synergy, Palm Backup, etc. They might not be the most profound implementation of those ideas... but they were AMAZING ideas that others are ripping off. I wanna see what else Palm can pull outta their sleeves.

There's a lot I love about this phone, and I didn't buy it on potential (tho it does have A TON more than any other phone). It does pretty much everything I need it to right now, even tho Calendar & Mail are a bit slow. I can deal with those while the platform continues to grow and solidify. But that's just me. If others don't see what I see, then I'll just end up leading a dull Android life. That'll be the end of liveliness & competition in the smartphone arena. Game over. Once you've tweaked Android v4.8, you'll forget what REAL tweaking was like. Right now... "There is another", and I will enjoy my tweaking a new & different platform. This is what I consider fun. Other people... maybe not so much.

Mike20PR

you sir deserve a thanks for this post. Its the post that had made the most sense coming from a Palm supporter rather than the excuse of ''in due time''

Enjoy you Pre and perhaps i will join you all again when i see the update im looking for in webos

Cheers

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ADGrant

Your point is completely absurd. "every last one of them" did not "make the wrong decision hen it came to the "better phone"". The original iPhone was better than the competition in at least a couple of ways. Web browsing and media (mp3/video etc). It is still better than the competition for media consumption and has been equaled but not bettered in Web browsing.