Palm Purchases Palm OS Garnet Source Code

newtonjack · 12/06/2006, 11:46 PM

http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/9...t-source-code/

gtwo · 12/06/2006, 11:50 PM

Well, well, well. . . . does this mean the next generation PalmOS will be made by Palm (not Access) and be a Garnet piece (to run Palm PIM apps and heritage Palm programs) on top of a Linux kernel to provide for multi tasking?

Why pay $44 million if you are going to use ALP?

Tastypeppers · 12/06/2006, 11:51 PM

Humph. This means we're going to get a Treo 681, 682, 683 7/8, . . . .

Me? I like the Palm UI. I hope this means that future Treos will continue having the same friendly user interface. And multitasking. I don't care for wifi, much. Had it on various WM phones and never used it. But multitasking. Woof. Want it bad. Extremely useful.

Felipe · 12/07/2006, 12:04 AM

if anyone can fix palm os, it is palm who have extended it beyond what anyone thought it could go.

eKeith · 12/07/2006, 12:05 AM

Great news. Too bad they could not just repurchase complete ownership: they only were able to purchase the rights to use and modify it...

newtonjack · 12/07/2006, 12:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perry Holden

Well, well, well. . . . does this mean the next generation PalmOS will be made by Palm (not Access) and be a Garnet piece (to run Palm PIM apps and heritage Palm programs) on top of a Linux kernel to provide for multi tasking?

Why pay $44 million if you are going to use ALP?

Yea 44 mil is a lot especially to Palm, this is great news for Palm OS fans.

Tastypeppers · 12/07/2006, 12:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eKeith

Great news. Too bad they could not just repurchase complete ownership: they only were able to purchase the rights to use and modify it...

Yeah, it would be nice if they owned it outright, but why not rent it forever with the right to fix it up whenever you want? Way cheaper than buying it outright.

Plus the seller here probably had delusions of "someday I'll do something with this thing" (sounds like the stuff in my garage) so an outright sale would not be possible in any event.

Felipe · 12/07/2006, 12:13 AM

hey, if palm has money, how about buying verichat, then again they arent good with buying outside companies.

Malatesta · 12/07/2006, 12:42 AM

I dunno if this is good or bad.

It seems more like a temporary lifeline.

Can they "fix" Garnet? Who really believes that? They haven't in 3 years why think it now?

I just can't see how further iterations of 5.4X is going to be a good thing. It's not bad either to prolong your base e.g. to buy time but what is the end goal? The long term plan? More low-end devices?

newtonjack · 12/07/2006, 12:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by newtonjack

http://www.palminfocenter.com/news/9...t-source-code/

I see the PIC changed the wording from "Purchases" to " Licenses" Palm OS Garnet Source Code. Not that it makes much difference I just wanted to point out that those were PIC words, I just copied and pasted them here.

samkim · 12/07/2006, 01:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eKeith

Great news. Too bad they could not just repurchase complete ownership: they only were able to purchase the rights to use and modify it...

They got perpetual rights to use and modify it. I don't think they need anything else. All they're really missing by not buying PalmOS outright is the licensing revenue from all the other PalmOS licensees.

This news should confirm to any remaining doubters that Palm is not going to abandon PalmOS.

TreoRock · 12/07/2006, 04:14 AM

Awesome, does that mean that we should be seeing a ROM update pretty soon for the Treo 700p? I hope so...

Al

dpc · 12/07/2006, 05:24 AM

This is great news, i must say.

skfny · 12/07/2006, 11:37 AM

There will be another version of POS. But will it be any good? I'm going to listen to Palm's earnings call near the end of the month and see if they talk (in however vague terms) about new products for next year.

whatever7 · 12/07/2006, 11:46 AM

This does sound like Palm is going to hack multi tasking into PalmOS5.

Price seem high, why even split PalmOS out in the first place. It's not my money though.

I will say this. If ALP is released on a different phone with the POS competibility layer, I will get that before I get a Treo 700p++. In the long run I don't care if the Palm/Treo brand name will survive.

whatever7 · 12/07/2006, 11:49 AM

Didn't Palm had the license to use POS5 till 2010 or something? So this deal basically extend the license for as long as possible plus adding the ability to modify/fork it?

khaytsus · 12/07/2006, 12:09 PM

The problem here is I can see Palm staying with Garnet, which stinks..

I think they should push FULL BORE towards using a Linux solution. I too like the Palm interface, and feel they should stick with the look and feel. But the underlying memory management and task management needs to be pushed to a much higher level.

It worries me that Palm is simply going to keep using Garnet. We'll see.

eKeith · 12/07/2006, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Tastypeppers

Yeah, it would be nice if they owned it outright, but why not rent it forever with the right to fix it up whenever you want? Way cheaper than buying it outright.

Plus the seller here probably had delusions of "someday I'll do something with this thing" (sounds like the stuff in my garage) so an outright sale would not be possible in any event.

That's an interesting perspective. But if Palm disassembles the Garnet source code, modifies it and develops something innovative, say Cobalt+, with long-term potential, will ACCESS need to license it?

gtwo · 12/07/2006, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by khaytsus

The problem here is I can see Palm staying with Garnet, which stinks..

I think they should push FULL BORE towards using a Linux solution. I too like the Palm interface, and feel they should stick with the look and feel. But the underlying memory management and task management needs to be pushed to a much higher level.

It worries me that Palm is simply going to keep using Garnet. We'll see.

My guess, is that the next "PalmOS" will be a full blown Linux solution -- it will just have backwards compatibility with prior Palm applications by using some of the "modified" Garnet source code. The PIM apps may remain in PalmOS source code as well. This agreement by Palm with Access, now gives them back control over both their hardware and software future.

My 2 cents.

marcol · 12/07/2006, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samkim

They got perpetual rights to use and modify it. I don't think they need anything else.

Well maybe, but:

Q. What capabilities and rights does Palm get with this new agreement?

A. Under terms of this non-exclusive licensing agreement, Palm will now have the ability to perform its own builds. In the past, Palm had licensed limited rights to have access to the source code but relied on ACCESS to make the builds. Palm will now be able to do its own builds. In addition, Palm will also be able to self-certify the builds using the same criteria that ACCESS has been using.

Palm will also be able to use any portion of the Palm OS Garnet code in their products. However, it should be noted that if the included Palm OS Garnet code enables at least one Palm OS Garnet application to run, Palm is required to have this product pass the compatibility test. If this product passes the compatibility test, Palm is required to indicate Palm OS Garnet compatibility following the branding guidelines agreed by the two companies.

The agreement also grants Palm the right to integrate Palm OS Garnet on top of other operating systems.

http://www.access-company.com/develo.../palm_faq.html

Assuming they don't go down the route of abandoning Garnet apps completely, how hamstrung will Palm be by this compatibility test? Clearly what Access have in mind (and seem to have sealed up pretty tight) is a scenario in which Palm either uses Garnet pretty much as is or modifies it to run in emulation on Linux (just like ALP), but either way Palm can't do anything so fundamental that apps won't be compatible with the Palm OS bit of ALP. They want a system in which developers can build apps that will run on either the Palm product or the Access product. That has to be pretty constraining, doesn't it?

I guess Access see Garnet emulation as a boost early on that will distinguish ALP from other linux offerings, but will hope to get developers to move their apps out of emulation and over to MAX asap. Perhaps Palm have exactly the same plan (excepting it will be their linux-based OS and their application framework of course). Either way this marriage of convenience glued together with a compatibility test doesn't look to me like one that is going to see many anniversaries.

Also of note from the faq:

Q. What will ACCESS name future versions of the operating system?

A. We are currently using the code name ACCESS Linux Platform for our next generation operating system. We will announce the official name of the ACCESS Linux Platform when we announce that it is available to our licensees and developers—expected sometime in the first half of 2007.

So ALP devices next year?